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Thread subject: Egg Missing at Woods Hole
||05/23/10 02:27 pm
||Just checked...of course one osprey not brooding and unless the egg is "hiding" one seems to be missing.
||05/23/10 02:33 pm
||Uhh, I thought there were three eggs, so it looks like two are missing? or hidden?
||05/23/10 02:51 pm
||I still see only one egg and the bird is sitting at the side of it...not brooding. The eggs have been left uncovered so much I would not be surprised if some opportunist predator had snatched two of them. They COULD be covered by nesting material but it looks doubtful.
||05/23/10 02:57 pm
||I never saw the 3rd! Stand corrected....2 eggs missing! What a shame. Wondering if a study has ever been done to determine if maybe the instinct to brood "never" kicks in.
||05/23/10 04:07 pm
||There were none at all to be seen earlier. I posted in the thread below that one was visible early this morning, then it got buried under a load of leaves and other bedding. That was a white egg though.
So the question is, is this one of the other two that's miraculously re-appeared, or has she laid a fourth egg today.
They're a right pair, that's all I know. I keep vowing not to look any more because I find myself transfixed by the goings on and never get to look at anything else. But they keep pulling me back - I think I'm doomed! ;)
||05/24/10 09:59 am
||I'm very sure, now, after comparing countless pics of head markings, that these are the original resident WHOI Cam Ospreys. It's very difficult to compare pics from the old cam and new cam.
The intruder issues on the WHOI nest, this season, have been well documented by many cam viewersĂ˘€Â¦both in commentary and pics.
This is Dr. Rob Bierregaard's answer to questions I had about the intruder issues Hilton Head, SC, Cape Coral, FL, this season and Conanicut, RI, Cape Henlopen, DE last season. I posted this on the Hilton Head blog.
"I don't know exactly how long they have to get going. We've had young fledge in mid-late August on the Vineyard, so that pair probably didn't lay until late May. It may have been a renesting after a lost clutch, or it could have been one of these turn-over in the breeding pair situations, which very often result in no nesting for that year. I suspect that most of the intruder situations occur when one of the adults doesn't return and the fight to fill the vacancy is really protracted because none of the contestants has the psychological advantage of having been there the previous year. "Home-court advantage" is really a big deal in birds.Ă˘€Â¨Eggs are produced about 2-3 days apart (more if the female is not in really good condition). I suspect that they could recycle only if it's really early in the nesting season. Whether they recycle or not would depend on physiological condition, and what the levels of estrogen were in the female's blood."
PICS COMPARING HEAD MARKINGS
Looking back at nest caps, I don't believe there was a third eggĂ˘€Â¦.but I have more screen recordings to checkĂ˘€Â¦.
||05/24/10 10:35 am
||I am definitely seeing one egg and what looks like the edge of a second egg buried in the grass right behind it and no signs of brooding.
I haven't been able to pay as much attention to this nest as I would like (nor any other one, for that matter) but I am wondering if we aren't seeing the result of competition among several ospreys.
||05/24/10 10:51 am
||Thanks Jazzel. Even more confusing. I'd decided this must be a young inexperienced female who associates sitting on the nest with having fish delivered. You've blown that theory out of the water.
Which of them do you think is doing the incubating? I thought it was the male but if there's a chance some of the eggs aren't his, then that wouldn't make any sense.
I haven't seen any intruders when I've been watching, though it is clear from this pair's behaviour at time that they are about. But that in itself wouldn't stop them sitting on the eggs?
I think I agree with you that there were probably only two eggs. I know one is definitely buried as I saw that happen yesterday morning. The one we see now appeared several hours later.
I hope you manage to make sense of this nest one fine day. It's a real puzzle at the minute.
||05/24/10 10:58 am
||Thank you for your opinion and posts, Jazzel. Will the informatiion posted here also be posted on the WHOI blog? I'm sure there are followers that are not familiar with DPOFsite.
||05/24/10 11:53 am
||The male is doing the incubating. But part time incubating will not result in a hatch.
The intruders are not an issue now...but they were at the start of the season, resulting in a very late start for the resident pair. It makes perfect sense that the male would incubate and fish...he would be doing this, at this stage in a normal season. It also makes sense that the female is not incubating, consider what Dr. Bierregaard said about the females estrogen blood level...
As I said I believe this is the resident pair from past seasons.
A "young inexperienced" female would be three or four years old, and fishing for herself since her first migration, she would also be fishing for herself until her eggs hatched, while the male took over incubation duty. I think she's simply guarding her nest.
There are many ospreys in the area...including the new nesting pair on a building 500 yards from the cam nest, and more young ones arriving...a distraction, but not a intruder take over issue.
The WHOI pair are guarding the nest...insuring their claim for next season....note Dr. Bierregaard's comment on "Home-court advantage"
Hope this helps. This is a great learning experience..take notes : - )
||05/24/10 12:47 pm
||jazzel wrote "It also makes sense that the female is not incubating, consider what Dr. Bierregaard said about the females estrogen blood level."
Rob mentioned the estrogen/ blood levels in a female in regards to "recycling" ie: producing a second clutch. Not in brooding or incubating.
After that second egg was laid a experienced female would have brooded. Many of us here have said its usually right after the first egg as we have all observed. IMO there are any number of reasons why she really never brooded. 1...shes a young female not a resident. 2...or maybe she knows something we dont?
I wrote in my 2007 notes that these birds do everything for a reason. So who knows. 07 was the year of all the attacks. Betty didnt eat for 5 days and one day only brooded for 20 minutes. Dennis wasnt on the nest for 3 days because he was deffending his nest.
After watching DPOF for a "few" years I suspect this female is a first timer.
||05/24/10 12:51 pm
||Thanks for the info. Jazzel, but I may have a feather stuck in my brain or something cause I'm a bit confused. If it is your opinion this is the same resident pair, do you mean from last season with the old cam? And if it is the same pair, then why would the female be considered inexperienced? I have been aware of this nest in the past, but this year is the first year that I check it here and there, particularly since eggs have been present. I'm not up on all the "history " of the nest. Thanks!
||05/24/10 12:56 pm
||I agree, this female gives all indications of being a new female, and btw, I am having a hard time posting a reply to this thread...it reads "insert failed". I didn't see Mickey's reply till well after several tries and only after I wrote my questioning of this being the original pair.
||05/24/10 05:35 pm
||CELESTE, Anne UK1, said "a young inexperienced female" if you go back and read the posts, it may help to clear the "feathers" : - )
You may also want, go to the MAINE BALD EAGLE forum, BIRD CAMS AROUND THE WORLD forum, HANCOCK WILDLIFE forum and, also the WHOI BLOG.
Also, it may help to go back to pg. 9 of this chat room. I posted on 4/19 my observations. I believed then as I do now, and could very well be wrong, this female is the resident from past seasons. I was unsure of the male because there was more than one male, or I could be wrong. Just posting what I observe.
If the USA had a banding programĂ˘€Â¦as the UK doesĂ˘€Â¦we wouldn't be wasting our time with these questions!!!!
On the subject of questions, Mickey, and anyone that doesn't have itĂ˘€Â¦Dr. Bierregaard's Email address.
Looking forward to his answers to your questions : - )
||05/24/10 05:51 pm
||Thanks again Jazzel. I wasn't sure what Rob meant by recycling - particularly after seeing those first eggs get buried!
Guarding the nest for next season makes sense - but if that's what she is doing I wish she'd share the information with the male. Poor chap seems to have no idea that all she does is sit on that perch all day stretching her toes and wings and looking bored stiff. Then when he's doing his incubating stint all she does is nag him to go fetch her a fish. If she were human she'd be watching tv and painting her nails, waiting for him to get home from a hard day's work and pour her a drink.
Oh well, if you get no eggs this year you've at least learnt some new behaviour. And it is a fantastic cam picture :)
Celeste I've had the same "insert failed" message on other threads. Maybe it's a glitch Tom needs to fix?
||05/25/10 07:54 pm
||When Rob says recycling he is referring to a second clutch. Im just going to have to disagree with Jazzel when she says "shes very sure" this is the pair from last year on the Whoi blog. IMO its certainly not the female from seasons past. I think I can say that from observing the lack of her brooding activity and comparing it to brooding activity on the DPOF nest and a few others.
Jazzel I have a question for you. If the Whoi female is the same female from years past why has she changed her brooding action all of a sudden this year? Its practically non existant this year. You`ve already reported the Hawks are a non issue now. With two different cams, different cam angles and diff nests, I wouldnt trust bird captures to use as a comparison. I wont say this on your blog because I realize Im coming across as disrespectful. I dont mean to be. I just think your wrong lol
||05/26/10 01:13 pm
||I fully support Mickey and his excellent reasoning on this. Even if he didn't ask me:-).
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